Experimental IRC log happs-2008-01-17

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These logs are provided as an experiment in indexing discussions using IRCHub.py, Irc2RDF.hs, and SIOC.

04:35:13<gislik>Hi everyone, I'm in the phase of wanting to learn Haskell and I think HAppS is just the right platform for me to do it. I've watched BayFP Presentation and I'm just so excited to get to know HAppS better. The only problem is that I don't seem to find a lot of documentation on it. Can anyone recommend the best way for me to start this journey}
04:57:25<gislik>?
18:23:06<mightybyte>Anyone here?
18:24:31<perspectivet>I'm kind of here
18:24:36<mightybyte>Cool
18:25:20<mightybyte>I was looking for some advice about how to design HAppS state data structures to facilitate scaling and efficient querying.
18:25:50<mightybyte>Do you have any knowledge about that?
18:28:58<perspectivet>What sort of query's are you looking at, relational type queries?
18:29:24<mightybyte>Well, since that would be the alternative to happs state, probably yes.
18:30:07<perspectivet>AFAIK you can do relational queries of happs state using ixset.
18:30:19<mightybyte>In comparing the two, I concluded that the advantages to using a relational database backend for persistence is that you have the full power of relational queries available outside your web app.
18:30:23<perspectivet>Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't played with any ixset stuff yet.
18:30:57<mightybyte>Ok, that sounds like a good place to start. I'll look and see what it has to offer.
18:32:19<gislik>Hi everyone, I'm in the phase of wanting to learn Haskell and I think HAppS is just the right platform for me to do it. I've watched BayFP Presentation and I'm just so excited to get to know HAppS better. The only problem is that I don't seem to find a lot of documentation on it. Can anyone recommend the best way for me to start this journey?
18:33:06<mightybyte>gislik: Join the club. :) I'm having the same trouble.
18:33:29<mightybyte>Here's one tutorial that I found helpful http://bluebones.net/2007/09/simple-haskell-web-programming-with-happs/
18:33:30<perspectivet>Follow "Getting Started" on www.happs.org. read the examples. try to build something. If you get stuck, read the code.
18:33:38<gislik>mightybyte: hehe OK
18:34:17<mightybyte>I also have this page open in my web browser: http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/HAppS_tutorial#h
18:34:30<mightybyte>But I'm getting the feeling that it's out of date.
18:34:56<perspectivet>from the page "Most of the stuff on this page refers to HAppS 0.8.8. The cutting edge version of HAppS (as of September 2007) is 0.9.1a and contains many API changes. It is probably not worth learning how 0.8.8 worked. If you know anything about 0.9.1 you might consider updating this page."
18:34:58<gislik>Thank you for this. I've read seen some blog entries on bluebones.net but this one I've not yet read
18:35:16<gislik>Yes I sometimes have the feeling that tutorials are outdated
18:35:23<perspectivet>yes
18:35:47<mightybyte>Since my linux distro has 0.8.8 as a package, that tutorial still helps me.
18:36:13<mightybyte>And it does give me some general familiarity with the concepts.
18:36:30<gislik>i might just end up reading the source code for HAppS in order to understand how things relate to everything
18:36:47<mightybyte>Come to think about it, that first link I gave you is probably also for 0.8.8
18:36:48<gislik>I was just hoping I wouldn't need to
18:37:09<mightybyte>Yes, I'm thinking that looks like the best option.
18:37:31<perspectivet>gislik: If you're learning haskell, I wouldn't recommend that as a starting point.
18:37:49<gislik>if I'll be successful I might jot down a few notes while i'm learning
18:38:41<gislik>perspectivet: OK, what would you recommend? I'm very familiar with web development and therefore I'm able to compare Haskell/HAppS very easily to something I know
18:38:56<mightybyte>I'll second perspectivet. You might want to try some more general haskell tutorials first.
18:39:10<mightybyte>Yet Another Haskell Tutorial (YAHT) is excellent.
18:39:22<perspectivet>the problem is that happs makes use of a lot of derivative libs like template haskell.
18:39:34<perspectivet>They don't really give you a sense of how to program haskell.
18:39:39<gislik>OK, that's a good advice. I have YAHT open in another window ;)
18:39:43<mightybyte>Yeah, I've had little success deciphering template haskell thus far.
18:40:06<perspectivet>yaht is pretty good, not so good for monads, but everything else is pretty
18:40:22<mightybyte>Yeah, hunt around for other monad tutorials.
18:40:25<perspectivet>I thought the haskellwiki monads page was better for monads
18:40:42<perspectivet>takes a while to work through, but worth the effort.
18:41:27<gislik>ok so what you're saying is that in order to understand some of the HAppS functionality it's vital to understand some of the more complex concepts in Haskell. I can buy that
18:42:39<perspectivet>I would say that in order to make the most of haskell in any setting, happs is not the place to start.
18:42:41<mightybyte>I'm also new to HAppS, but I would say you should write a few haskell programs on your own before tackling HAppS.
18:42:53<perspectivet>mightybyte: definitely
18:43:29<gislik>how/where are people using HAppS today? Do you deploy it as a personal hobby or is it being used in real projects?
18:44:31<mightybyte>It powers hpaste.
18:45:45<gislik>OK. So anyways, thanks guys for this very appreciated advice :)
18:46:27<mightybyte>No problem. You'll find many helpful people on #haskell.
18:46:50<gislik>thanks this will be my new destination
21:01:03<perspectivet>wb gislik
21:04:27<gislik>:)
21:04:29<gislik>thnx

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