Experimental IRC log happs-2008-04-09

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These logs are provided as an experiment in indexing discussions using IRCHub.py, Irc2RDF.hs, and SIOC.

14:12:22<MarcWeber>updating state using HAppS is simple.. Not that simply is the data representation (when thinking of relational data RDBMS are typically used for)
14:12:54<MarcWeber>I mean you can use foreign keys or you could use kind of IORef..
14:14:04<Saizan>hard to serialize an IORef :)
14:14:59<MarcWeber>Ah hi.. I'm still struggling with all this type stuff :) ..
14:15:30<MarcWeber>queryEqual (Name "abc') should also return only one value if Name is a uniq key ..
14:16:50<MarcWeber>An IORef is nothing but a typesafe pointer, isn't it?
14:17:26<MarcWeber>For serializing you would have to introduce kind of ids as well. So you can use them from the beginning?
14:18:22<Saizan>i guess so, since you want to avoid copying
14:18:53<MarcWeber>and IORefs are used within IO monads.
14:19:52<MarcWeber>But it takes less space in memory. You don't need the key in your data record.
14:20:58<MarcWeber>I think you can say that an id takes as much memory as an IORef becuase I guess that they are aligned in 4 or 8 byte blocks for speed reasons. Don't know at all how this is handled in haskell.
14:21:05<Saizan>you lose all the transaction guarantees with IORefs i think.
14:21:09<MarcWeber>Other languages have "packed" keywords
14:21:23<MarcWeber>Saizan: Why? If you manipulate them within a state event?
14:22:53<Saizan>MarcWeber: a state event is inside STM, so you could use TVars maybe? but i'm not sure if the happs interface let you do so
14:26:38<Saizan>i should shut up, since i don't have a clear idea on how multimater/sharding work.
14:29:29<MarcWeber>Using IORefs there is one advantage: You don't need to do a Map lookup. You only have to read the IORef
14:29:47<MarcWeber>That will be a little bit faster definitely.
14:33:28<MarcWeber>But when passing an id to JavaScipt you need a Map to get back the IORef..
14:36:20<Saizan>the pointer/graph model was that they used before realizing the relational one was safer and easier, they say
14:36:44<MarcWeber>Who is they?
14:37:21<Saizan>books on database systems
14:37:32<MarcWeber>I'm not sure how relational is defined. But a graph represents kind of relation.
14:38:20<MarcWeber>And graphs are represented by ids (hgl) I think ? I think it's using kind of uniq data type to represent connected edges
14:42:17<Saizan>yeah, hgl represents graphs in a relational way
15:32:43<MarcWeber>Saizan: You're right. STM .. Basically each row could be put into an STM monad.

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